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Merz and
Scholz clash on migration, economy and Trump: ‘How dumb can somebody be?’
Center-right
and center-left chancellor candidates clashed in a fiery debate, exposing deep
divisions just weeks ahead of a national election.
But when
Scholz claimed his government had successfully cracked down on abuses of the
asylum system, Merz shot back.
“You don’t
live on this planet,” he retorted. “What you’re saying is a fairy tale.”
February 9,
2025 10:37 pm CET
By Chris
Lunday and Nette Nöstlinger
BERLIN —
With just two weeks until Germany heads to the polls, German Chancellor Olaf
Scholz and conservative frontrunner Friedrich Merz tore into each other over
migration, the economy and how to handle U.S. President Donald Trump in a
combative debate on national television Sunday night.
“How dumb
can someone be?” Scholz asked at one point, attacking Merz for vowing to turn
away asylum seekers at Germany’s border — a move, he argued, that would violate
EU law and divide Europe at a time when Germany needs European solidarity to
counter Trump’s tariff threats.
But when
Scholz claimed his government had successfully cracked down on abuses of the
asylum system, Merz shot back.
“You don’t
live on this planet,” he retorted. “What you’re saying is a fairy tale.”
The clash
came against the backdrop of a political firestorm over Merz’s decision to try
to use votes from the far-right Alternative for Germany (AfD) to push tough
immigration proposals through the Bundestag.
The move
weakened Germany’s long-standing “firewall” against the far right, in place
since World War II. Scholz seized on the controversy to warn that Merz was
normalizing the far right. “I seriously fear you would consider a coalition
with the AfD after the election,” he said.
Merz denied
the charge that his conservatives have cooperated with the AfD, or would form a
coalition with the party: “Let me say this once again, very clearly and
explicitly, also to those who may wish otherwise: There will be no
cooperation.”
Later in the
debate, Merz faulted Scholz’s left-leaning government for enabling the AfD’s
sharp rise in the polls, calling the party a “serious threat to our democracy,”
and blaming the policies of Scholz, together with those of the Greens for
allowing it to happen. “There has long been no majority for left-wing politics
in this country,” he said.
With
Scholz’s Social Democratic Party (SPD), polling in third place, far behind
Merz’s leading conservatives, the debate represented one of Scholz’s last
chances to fundamentally alter the outlines of the race. The two leaders
clashed on economic and budget polices in particular, with Merz arguing for
broad tax cuts and greater fiscal discipline, while Scholz depicted such
policies as favoring the rich.
Merz, for
his part, characterized Scholz’s management of the economy as catastrophic,
blaming the current chancellor for the country’s deindustrialization. Scholz,
meanwhile, blamed external shocks: “I’m not the one who invaded Ukraine, I’m
not the one who stopped gas deliveries — that was [Russian President Vladimir]
Putin.”
Merz snapped
back, criticising Scholz’s decision to close three nuclear plants: “Then why in
God’s name did you end nuclear energy?” Scholz countered that restarting
reactors — an option conservatives have said they will explore — would cost €40
billion.
But one of
the biggest clashes of the night erupted over how to handle a possible trade
war with the U.S., with Scholz arguing that Merz’s migration policies would
undermine the solidarity Europe needed to stand up to Trump.
“Is Merz
really proposing that the biggest country in Europe, right in the middle,
should be the one breaking European law?” Scholz said, posing rhetorical
questions. “Where we will soon have to rely on the whole of Europe if we get
tariff policies from the American government, which would often be directed
against Germany and which we can only reject together?”
“What Mr.
Merz is proposing here is against German interests.”
Later in the
debate, the two leaders were asked whether the EU should respond to Trump’s
tariff threats with similar measures. Both suggested Europe is prepared to take
countermeasures.
“Tariffs are
certainly an instrument,” said Merz, harking back to 2018, when the
then-president of the European Commission, Jean-Claude Juncker, reached an
agreement with Trump in Washington to halt plans to introduce new tariffs
against the bloc.
“Strong
Europeans, strong response. Talk with the Americans on equal footing and tell
them clearly what is possible and what is not,” Merz said, summarizing his
approach to dealing with the new U.S. administration.
Scholz
suggested Europe already has a concrete plan for responding: “We are prepared
for this,” he said. “So the answer is, with the greatest diplomatic caution, we
can act as the European Union with an hour.”
But when
asked how to deal with Trump more broadly, both leaders offered vague answers.
“He is
predictably unpredictable,” Merz said of Trump. “We need a common European
strategy here, a common stance … If I were elected, I would invest a lot of
time and effort in creating this European unity.”
Scholz said
he had “already shown” his strategy for Trump: “Clear words and friendly
talks.”
This story
has been updated.
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